Car War Stories

Get four car people together along with some adult beverages and the stories start. We were discussing dumb customers and I offered a story of one dumb customer.

Renton, WA around 1996, we had a red Honda Civic stuck back in the corner that was a “bad car”. The question was to send it to a salvage yard or spend money fixing it.

A couple in their thirties come onto the lot and “landed” themselves on this Honda. Figuring me to be a lying car salesman who was “saving” the car for some favored customer, they insisted on a test drive. OK, get three sets of keys and dig it out. At least the battery held enough charge to start it.

Test drive over, they want to buy it. I tried to show them other cars which only convinced them the car was a steal. So in we go and I do the paperwork and get their money.

At the dealership we used a “We Owe” form to put all promises in writing.  My manager flat told them he thought it was a “bad car”. Further, he would prefer to sell them a “good car”. They signed a We Owe with the following statement, “We have been informed by the manager of Sunset Cars he considers this a “bad car”. We choose to buy it anyway”.

Within two weeks they found out the manager didn’t lie. Somewhere between Ellensburg and Yakima the engine sized and they lost control and crashed.

They then show up at the dealership demanding their money back plus expenses related to the car failure. After being politely told to wish in one hand, shit in the other, and see which filled first, they left.

At the time, the Washington State Attorney General’s Office investigated complaints against car dealers. They were hardly neutral and would come into a business with an attitude. The customer had filed a complaint and an AG Investigator showed up. 

Our manager went to the back room, found the file, copied the We Owe, and handed the copy to the AG dudette. He then pointed to the door and went back to his desk. Later said it was a very satisfying moment.

My friends had their own stories but, on that occasion, mine was the best.

It Is Like Deja Vu All Over Again, Yogi

Yesterday sold my 1987 Bronco II. Bought it as a backup vehicle but we need to replace another vehicle and cash from the Bronco sale will help.

The buyer came from a Craigslist advertisement.  Within two minutes of shaking hands, reverted to my car salesman persona – kind of like riding a bicycle, you ever forget. In fact, it wasn’t until later I realized what happened.

Immediately became the friendly face, sympathetic listener, eager to help, and kind of dumb. Established some common ground, both of us ranch raised. 

In my many years of selling cars I never had the need to lie to make a sale. The prospects want to buy or they wouldn’t be here. Let them buy, don’t make it hard! Ask the right questions the right way and they will talk themselves into buying. It was their idea with no pressure from the salesman. Any car mutts out there that think I'm wrong? Somewhere I have a plaque from Suzuki proclaiming me the number one salesman of Suzuki Samurais in the United States.

And then the story began. It is for his girlfriend. Seems he left her on the East Coast seven months ago to return to Colorado and find employment. Okay? About 30 years old, 5’6”, 140 lbs he told me he had been a cop and corrections officer but had to give it up because he was in twenty six fights and had two excessive force charges. Learned about his brothers and sisters and which ones had been in jail. Learned about goat dairy farming. We went on the test drive. He then consulted with family members who were waiting in one of two vehicles the crew arrived in. Made the deal and the bat shit crazy drove away with a winning grin on his face. I returned to my apartment with a wad of Benjis in my pocket.

The very best car salesman I ever knew was my old buddy, the late Dirty Al Imhoff.  He would have said, about the transaction, “You are a baad man, Tankie”.

In case there is any question, I do not, repeat do not, want to start selling cars again.

But WSF, did you make money on the deal? Hell ya, about $500 on a $1,500 sale.

The Mighty Goose Hunter

The Service Manager at the dealership I spent several years with was a fanatical bird hunter. Our dealership, while along side the Interstate, was rural with a lot of farmland to our East and lakes and rivers to our Northwest. Geese flew low over our lot on a regular basis. Their honking would drive him nuts.

“Look Doug”, we would say. “They are giving you the finger.”

One day he snapped, got his shotgun out of his truck, and dropped a goose. The goose fell on top of a 53’ long haul trailer we used for storage, and then bounced behind the trailer, out of Doug’s sight. Leaving his shotgun, Doug walked out to and around the trailer to get his goose, only to be confronted by a large hawk who got there first.  The hawk wasn’t going to give up his free meal, and Doug wasn’t going to give up his goose. He came back with the goose but wouldn’t tell us how he got the goose away from the hawk. We suspected urine was involved.

Great guy, even is he did have bad habits, like being an old Chevy fan and restorer.  Not a current events guy, he drove around for two weeks with a rainbow sticker we put on his truck’s rear bumper before someone told him the significance. 

He had a great sense of humor, and was always willing to laugh at himself. One day he and his senior mechanic were trying to solve a difficult repair. Always helpful, I suggested, “Why don’t you send it out to a real mechanic?” Yeah, that was well received!

Short Time On A Job

Seems some readers like car stories. Here is another.

My shortest time, at a dealership as a car salesman, was five hours. I did leave as a minor legend.

In the last century (pretentious, yes, but love the phrase) a car salesman had the most portable job imaginable. Walk onto a lot, show the manager some past pay stubs, and go to work on the spot.

A friend was a manager at a Chevrolet store South of Seattle and talked me into coming to work there. Started at 9 am and around 1:30 a car pulled in and the driver parked off to the side. An UP! I went over and greeted him. The conversation went something like this.

“Hello, welcome to H_______ Motors. Thanks for coming in today.”

Big smile, extended hand. The driver rudely slapped my hand away and said something along these lines. “I own this place, and I don’t talk to any fucking salesman. You got that, jackoff?”

“Excuse me, Mr. H_______. I didn’t know who you were. It won’t happen again.”

Then he got two good punches in the gut. He folded up and puked his lunch all over himself. The alcohol smell was overpowering. This was pre cell phone days. I walked over to the used car office, grabbed a phone, and called the police.

“Yeah, this is ‘The Tank’ over here at H_____ Motors on _______. I just had a drunk take a swing at me and had to defend myself.”

Police arrive, Smell him. Asked me if I saw him drive in. Asked me if I would testify in court that I saw him drive in and get out of the vehicle.

“Oh, hell yes!”

People, especially managers, were milling around. Mr. H______ had regained the ability to talk.  Didn’t matter, he was cuffed and stuffed.

After he was hauled away, the managers started motherfucking me. I just smiled, picked up my umbrella, and went over to my truck. Offered to fill the most vocal one’s dance card but he was all bluster. Drove off. One hour later I was back at my old lot where we all kissed and made up. Sold a car that night.

Never was called to testify. Saw Mr. H_______ a few times after that at various car venues. For some reason he stayed clear of me.

I’ve had a lifetime problem controlling my temper. Sometimes it does feel so good to lose it.

When he slapped my hand away, that was taking a swing at me. Calling the police was a tactical move. Being first with my story, and him being drunk, negated his position and money.

The moral of the story? Don’t go all wretched on a dirty white boy.

Sister Kink

See where Colorado State Representative Lori Saine (R) Dacono has managed to get herself mentioned in national news outlets, again. Not bad for a first term representative.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/09/06/rep-lori-saine-fried-chicken-poverty-hearing_n_3882811.html

http://twitchy.com/2013/02/19/colorado-rep-lori-saine-fights-like-a-girl-for-2nd-amendment-rights/

Lori was a minor legend in the car business and one of the hardest working people I’ve ever known. We worked together for years. She was also one of the kinkiest salespeople I’ve ever known. In this context, nothing sexual is implied. 

To the best of my knowledge, she is a totally faithful wife to her husband. 

Rather, it is the way she dealt with customers. Every single deal had a complication (kink) in it. Now, in the car business, “You kinky motherfucker”, is often a high compliment. In this context, she was a superstar. Not every deal needs a kink; it is not necessary. She just couldn’t resist.

Super competitive, she was driven to win every contest. We often had six position “walk around” competitions as part of ongoing sales training. As you walk around a vehicle, at each position you present advantages, benefits, and commitment.

“This car has six airbags. If you are unfortunate as to be in an accident, they will protect you. That’s important to you, isn’t it?”

Usually, I was the only person at the dealership that could best her. While I really didn’t give a rat’s ass about winning, I did enjoy making her sweat. A seasoned pro can spend an hour doing six position sales. Every item on a vehicle, if you know your product, has a selling point.

“Folks, this vehicle has safety rims. Say you have a blowout. No matter what, the tire will not come off the rim and tie up your steering. Gives you a little peace of mind, doesn’t it? And, once you are safely stopped, call your complimentary roadside service to have the spare put on.”

Now, by law since 1932, every vehicle sold in the United States that carries passengers has safety rims.

At one point, I was overseeing four used car lots. I recommended Lori to manage the Windsor, CO operation. When I say she was a hard worker, look at the pictures below. The snow plow operator piled snow directly in front of a bay door. We needed to get the vehicle parked in the bay out. I arrived to find Lori, all 5’2” of her, attacking the frozen pile with a shovel.

                           

I think we will be hearing more about Lori in the future. If hard work, long hours, and sheer determination alone makes for success in politics, she will be there for a long time. God help us all!

Precis

Another car story, as requested from one of the (four or five) readers. In 1988, Hyundai did not have a good reputation. Mitsubishi, in their wisdom, rebadged the base Hyundai and call it a Precis. Since Mitsubishi didn’t have a much better reputation than Hyundai, selling a Precis was a challenge. (Many Mitsubishis were, for the time, good vehicles)

Circa 1988, enlisted military personnel under the rank of E-7 were not welcomed by most lenders making car loans. This is a story of one such financing effort.

First, the customer was black, i.e., African American. My description of him is not racially motivated; just painting a picture. Bluntly, when selling a car, I didn’t care anything at all about a customer except for three questions. First, did they have the means to buy a car? Second, would they make a purchasing decision? Third, were they legally able to buy (age, driver’s license, mentally competent)?

I was moved, not willingly, from my comfortable niche at the Ford franchise in a multiple franchise operation and dispatched to the Mitsubishi store to be a “closer”. This was supposedly a promotion. Yeah, blow me. My job was to “takeover” a sale when the first salespersons floundered,  and find a way to “close” the sale. Did the customer like this? We didn’t care. Old school, hard core selling was the order of the day.

The customer was a black E-3 airman from McCord AFB. He was tall, gangly, walked like he learned how to move from chickens (arms flailing, head bobbing up and down), and had an arrogant attitude. He overwhelmed the salesman,  and I was sent in.

As I came in, he stood up and announced, “Ize don’t want no fucking Precis”.

 Using my best NCO voice, I said, “Sit down!” He folded up in the chair. “Let me explain something to you. You are an airman. No one wants to finance you. You have $500, that’s it. You need a bank to buy you a car and let you buy it back from them one month at a time. Do you understand me?”  

“Shit, man, you hard”, he responded. 

“The only car the bank is going to buy you is a Precis. You have three choices. Buy some beater piece of shit that will break down, strand you, and make you AWOL. Or, you can keep bumming rides and use the bus. Or, you can drive the only car that the bank will buy you. What is it going to be?” 

He sat there in the chair, twisting, twitching, and bobbing up and down. “Can I gets me a red one”, he asked?

 “No”, I said, “Blue or silver.”

He again did his spastic chicken imitation and cried out, “Silver." 

Paperwork started, and forty five minutes later he was driving away in his silver Precis. As he hit the driveway, he spotted me, and yelled, “I still don’t want no fucking Precis.”

Three weeks later he was back for his license plates. The windows were tinted black. He had a sub woofer strong enough to vibrate the body panels. I made the weak suck salesman go out and put the plates on.  The customer told him, “Ize don’t got no damned Hyundai; I got’s me a Precis!”

Ah, wonderful. A happy customer.

Sales Management Rant

This is a rant aimed at people in sales, emphasis automobile sales, and sales managers. May be of marginal interest, or none at all,  to others.

Recently a young friend and I were discussing focus as it pertains to work, specifically sales.

In the years I worked in retail automobile sales, the end all and be all was seeing an inventory piece leave the lot with a temporary permit in the back window. Without that happening, everything else was meaningless. Customer satisfaction, proper paperwork, putting away demos, etc., all played a part. None was critical to the dealership remaining in business. No sales, no cash flow, no business.

Sales are hard. People don’t just roll over and part with significant sums of money without a lot of effort. It is easy to become immersed in the details, schedule meetings, attending training sessions and all the other distractions. It is easy to trick fuck your mind that you are actually doing something. Yes, that was me from time to time. The further you work your way up in management, the easier it is to insulate yourself from the real world of belly to belly with a customer. If, every day, you aren’t feeling that same anxiety in your gut that your newest hire green pea is feeling, you suck as a manager. You subordinates know, in their gut, that you are phoning it in. 

Want an example? “I want to see a credit app before I give them numbers”. (Prepare a proposal to show the customer).  Oh, you don’t want to “waste” your valuable time?  Git!

My dealer principal had a personal friendship with the president of a car company whose line we carried. The parent company fired him (for what? Who knows with Koreans). He bought an old, established automobile aftermarket remanufacturer. He then talked my boss into jump starting his sales efforts. My boss then made it, in part, my project. Soon it was my problem, er, project.

A classic oil/vinegar corporate conflict ensued. Corporate MBA mindset meets car retail, “produce or git”, ethos.

Returning to focus, it was apparent to us, the car guys, that their “car leaving the lot with a temporary permit” was the telephone ringing at their inbound sales desk. More phone calls, more sales. Making that phone ring became our focus for the next several months. We were successful. We were resented, even hated, by everyone, except the people manning the sales desk, in that company.

We focused on short belly to belly sales presentations at every repair shop and parts retailer we could find. Goal? A minimum of twenty physical contacts per day.  By short, we had a thirty second presentation, and a five minute presentation. The single goal was to get our little stick decal with our phone number on the wall next to their phone. Stick our name in their mind, so they would call us when they needed something. The gate keeper? Someone at that business trusted that person to be their public face. Who were we to disagree? Many, many times the gate keeper was also the one ordering parts and supplies.

One large account was one of the larger auto dismantlers in the country. They carried us as a minor sideline.  We were invited to have a training meeting with their inside sales force. My presentation was tailored to busy people who needed a few bullet points and access to more information when needed. Start to finish, it was about twenty minutes followed by another ten minutes of questions and answers. Was it effective?  Months later the dismantler bought the remanufacturer. Was my presentation the reason? Big plants grow from small seeds, bubba.

My tenure with this operation was less than two years. I flat wouldn’t get involved with their bullshit meetings, the endless Sigma Six, ISO 9000 blah, blah, blah discussion, or what buyers they had taken to lunch. My small crew was thrown out of more places by noon on Monday then the rest of those asshats saw in a week. I’m sure a two hour lunch in an upscale restaurant is more fun then dodging a junk yard dog in the weed filled parking area of a West Texas oilfield support business. I also know which makes the phone ring. Focus, remember?

Whenever I write something like this, the YAHBUT choir starts singing. “Well, yah, but our/my situation is different because…………” Please understand, I don’t give a rat’s ass about your situation. If you have anything on the ball, you will be asking yourself, “How does this fit my situation? What is here that I can use”? I doubt I’ve ever had a truly original idea in my whole life. I’ve made a living, supported my family, and kept the lights on by listening to people smarter than I am. I still remember that old school car sales trainer, Jackie Cooper, saying, “Winners do what losers won’t”.

In summary, my advice to my young friend was this. Identify that key element in your business that keeps you in business. Focus on that, and don’t let yourself be distracted. Other things will require your attention, and you need to deal with them. Don’t let them keep you from your key element.

For those who have taken flying lessons, remember the instructor’s admonishment to, first and always, fly the damned airplane.

All photographs taken from Google. If they are yours, and you want them removed, please contact me.

Control Freaks, Auto Sales Sub Species

Something for the few auto retailers out there that occasionally drop by. For those with no interest in the subject, you may want to stop here.

First, a short back story. The dealer principal who was able to tolerate me for many years, and his family, have become  both a business and personal relationship. Recently, one of his sons has started selling cars. He is also the one this Latter Day Luddite calls for computer tech help. I sometimes mentor him in his sales efforts. This was written with him in mind.

Too many people retailing automobiles are, at their core, weak, insecure, anxious and fearful. They appear to be Type A confident and forceful; it is an act. They are control freaks, and, far to often, bullies. Then they get promoted to management and inflict their insecurities on their staff.

There is a whole sub industry of sales trainers who convince dealers, or manufacturers, to pay them to train the sales forces. Some are excellent (Grant Cardone), and many just tell the trainees what the dealer principals want to hears (as opposed to what they need to hear). What the dealers want to hear is CONTROL! To get one customer (up) on the lot, dealers will  spend hundreds of dollars in advertising and promotions. When that “up” comes on the lot, the dealer considers them an asset and wants to maximize their return. Hence, sales people are trained to “get and keep control”. Sales people know they will be severely berated is they don’t “control” the customer. All this is bullshit. That “up” is a human being, and that is what you need to deal with.

Hear it comes. YEAH, BUT! Look dummy, you always have control because you have the car, not them. At some point, they will cede control to you to get what they want. Your job is to make them feel comfortable, and to build value and desire in the car.

So how do you, neophyte salesperson, sell a car? First, a proper greeting. Welcome them,  introduce yourself, and thank them for coming in. Then SHUT UP. I guarantee that any question you ask at this point will get, “We’re just looking”.  If you keep your pie hole closed, they will tell you what they want. Not always, not immediately, but they will tell you. Have patience, but don’t let them walk the lot alone. It is your house, not theirs. Then find them a car THEY like. At this point it doesn’t matter what it is, only that they like it. Don’t ask them any personal questions. Once they are somewhat comfortable with you, they will start giving you information. If they are worried about their credit, about their trade, etc., they will bring it up,  if you give them the chance.

Once you “land” them on a car, build value. Always, ABC (advantage, benefit, commitment). “This model has a xxx,xxx mile warranty. You won’t have to pay for any repairs for a long time. Is that something important to you?” (If you are going to be successful, you better learn your product. Back in the day, I could come up with thirty or more ABCs on any vehicle on the lot. Rarely lost a walk around contest). You have “landed” them on a car. Now comes the most important step, the test drive. Get them to drive the car. On the test drive, keep you mouth shut unless they ask you a question or you need to keep them on the route you have already established.

Towards the end of the drive, you go for the “baby” commitment.

“Folks, do you like the car? If they answer yes, then you say, “If we make you a great deal, will you drive it home today”? Expect some resistance but, in a polite manner, persist. Once you have a “yes”, take them inside and put it on paper (the write up). At this point, you have done all the heavy lifting. Now, your managers will do their part.

During the write up, the problems come out. Credit, trade, down payment, whatever. They may not be able to buy the car they drove. At this point, the customer has a lot of time and emotion invested. They do not want to go somewhere else and start over. Now, you can direct them to the car they can buy. Now, who has control? Remember, they came to your lot because you have something they want, and you have always been in control. Repeat, they came to the lot to buy a car; let them buy. Don’t fight them.

"But WSF, I don't want to waste my time." Really, what else do you have? Retailing automobiles and efficiency aren't even in the same time zone. Want efficiency? Go to work for UPS.

During my decades retailing vehicles, I kept score. How many ups, how many test drives, how many write ups, how many sales? While not a superstar, I would sell one out of 4.3 ups. The best I personally worked with was Dirty Al, who sold one out of three. The national average, as I recall per NADA, was North of one out of six.

Your biggest obstacle towards success is your manager. Don’t stay in a store with bad managers. That dinosaur brain in the tower is your worse obstacle. If the Finance office is stealing your gross, get out! I was fortunate to have four great managers, including my friend's father.  I stayed with them until they left. Quite possible my worst manager was myself.

Like many people, I got into car sales because I needed a job, and that was all I could find. To my surprise, it allowed me to  earn what I needed to make the other parts of my life (like feeding my kids) work. Prestige? From an early age, I’ve not given a rat’s ass what the world, outside of the family,  thought of me. Your mileage may differ.

Smart Ass Gets Slapped

A friend wants another car lot story. Prefers one that puts me down. Oh well, I aim to please.

Part of my selling technique was to use humor to keeps the atmosphere relaxed. The customers are in a stressful situation; take the curse off.

Collecting the down payment check was one such stress point. Major commitment point. After naming the amount, and their bringing out their checkbook, I would usually say, "Please make that out to 'Frank's Good Times, Inc'." Usually got a laugh, or a rude comment or two. Relieved the stress.

One day the customer was a nice lady that had driven about two hours to come to our lot. I did my usual, and she made the check payable to Frank's Good times Inc. After seeing the payee, I told her I was, "Just joking". Her reply? "That is my last check".  Oh shit. I sat there thinking about how to handle this. Drive two hours to her house to get a check?

"Are you starting to sweat," She asked?

"Ah, yes I am."

"Good, because you have been making me sweat for the past hour," She said, as she brought out another checkbook.

Got me good, she did.

Car Buying Advice

I've shared my car buying advice with a few bloggers, most recently Ami

http://amimental.blogspot.com/2013/04/movie-night.html

The advice is in a document I keep and send to my various relatives and acquaintances who want me to "help" them buy a car.

In 1986 I got hired to sell Suzuki Samurais. I was out of work (construction) and somewhat desperate. The plan was to sell cars until construction came back. That lasted nearly thirty years. The first managers I worked with were veterans of the Ralph Williams' stores. A taste of their mindset.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DK6BksCzTKs
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lb-uE2xWmi8

Enough! Here is the "advice".


A person asked me to help them buy a car,  and I refused. I don’t want the responsibility.  A hardcore manager I had years ago was fond of saying, “That monkey is on your back and you are not giving it to me”.  Advice I will give.

NUMBER ONE RULE:  Never, ever, be in position of  “must buy right now”.  Yes it’s Thursday night, your hooptie died and you can’t get to work, see your squeeze, pick up your kids, etc.  Rent, borrow,  cab,  public transportation, a $800 P.OS that runs, whatever.  I try to always have a backup vehicle of some kind.  Once I commuted for three weeks in a truck with a 18’ cargo box.

NUMBER TWO RULE:  Price is  not the same as cost.  What you spend to buy your ride is just a start.  Insurance!  A Honda Fit may get a ton of miles out of a gallon of gas.  Insurance cost on it will put a hole in your budget.  Maintenance is overlooked.  Most used cars will still have an Owners Manual.  Find it and look up the chapter on maintenance.  Find out what theses items cost.  How? Work a little!   Find a dealership or an independent shop and ask.  The service department at a new car franchise should already have this info readily available.  Anything European has enormous parts costs (like $800+ headlights).  Like a Lexus?  The 60,000 mile service is close to $4,000.  A headlight assembly is $2,500.

NUMBER THREE RULE:  Know why you are buying what you are buying.  Hope your new ride will lead to enhanced social experiences?  Do you have people in your social/family/employment circle you are trying to impress?  Do  clients see your vehicle?  Need a 4x4 to get home or to work?  Is this vehicle your treat, to yourself, as a reward for your hard work?  Do you have kids in car seats?  How long will your back handle getting them in car seats in a coupe? Are you buying something to go on vacation once a year?  Ever think of renting a car for that vacation?  Diligent shopping may produce surprisingly low rental costs.  My personal vehicle is a 1996 Escort Wagon with 186,000+ miles.  It is not pretty.  It is reliable, gets over 30 mpg, hauls my overweight body down the road at illegal speeds and the title is in my file cabinet.  I’m not concerned what others think!  The only thing about any vehicle that impresses me is a large gross profit.

NUMBER FOUR RULE:  Always be emotionally prepared to walk away from any deal.  So, you have spent a lot of time at the process and you “just want to get it over with”? Get a backbone and become an adult!  You have found the perfect car/truck, you love it, and you want to drive it home but the numbers don’t work.  Every good seller wants you to buy right here, right now, don’t let it get away!!!!  Go back to Number One Rule.

PRIVATE PARTY,  DEALERSHIP OR  AGENCY?  The majority of used sales are private party.  It can be a win/win for the seller and buyer.  The seller gets more than they can trading in and the buyer gets to go eyeball to eyeball with those who put the miles on the vehicle.  Beware of the sub species “side winding sewer snake” curbstone dealer.  NEVER NEVER NEVER buy a vehicle from some who doesn’t personally own it and who’s name isn’t on the title!!!!!  I don’t care how wonderful the story is, be Nancy Reagan and just say NO!  ALWAYS have the vehicle checked out by a mechanic.  Be prepared to pay for one hour of  shop time.

 Often the seller, especially a dealership, will be resistant to having the vehicle inspected by a third party.  They are not always being evil; there are many valid reason for not letting a stranger drive away with thousands of dollars to be poked and prodded by another stranger.  Offer to have a firm appointment at the shop and let a seller’s representative come along. The principal items you want checked are timing belt, axles/CV boots, brakes, transmission and cooling system. You want them to check under the seats and behind the dashboard for water damage (a flood car). You do know that buying a vehicle with the “CHECK ENGINE” light illuminated qualifies you for the “Fool of the Day” award, don’t you?  As part of your test drive, locate a safe area where you can observe the vehicle, from the outside, being driven (by someone else) away from you in a straight line.  Observe how well the front and rear tires line up as the vehicle moves away.  This is the best way I know to spot a “framer”; a vehicle involved in an accident. A CARFAX report will tell you if the vehicle was ever a “rental rocket”.  Any vehicle with a SALVAGE title is suspect. Rarely can you obtain financing from a regular lender.  These vehicles often are sold Buy Here Pay Here.  ALWAYS take it to a Body Shop, pay for an hour of their time, and see if the car is intact enough to safely drive. I’ve seen more than one pieced together with rags, cardboard, Bondo and a slick paint job.

When you do business with a dealership you are buying convenience and saving time.  The owners and the staff are entitled to fair compensation.  If you are not willing to fairly pay them, don’t waste their time! Can you do well financially at the dealership?  Yes, if you are reasonable, have educated yourself so you recognize a fair deal and you are prepared to buy right here, right now!  Another hardcore manager I worked for explained his philosophy like this, “I will always let the customer have the opportunity to pay  FULL RETAIL.  After an hour of grinding their tits off I will take a $300 (gross profit) deal.  It just iron, I can get more iron than I can customers.”  I liked well prepared customers.  I loved them when they made an appointment in the morning.  We could have them in an out in an hour. The usual rodeo is three hours on a used and four on a new.  Take a short deal from Mrs. and Mrs. Prepared? - You bet!  Money in my pocket and back on the floor works for me!  What will hurt you is how you approach a car dealership.  Understand everyone works on a commission basis up to and including the owner. They don’t sell; they don’t eat.  They HATE time wasters (by their definition).  If you are looking for “information” or “data” you are a time waster.  If your want to “look around” you are time waster.  No well run dealership will let you wander around unaccompanied.  Don’t like that?  Buy your own dealership and run it however you want.  Show up with a notebook and computer printouts and you are instantly labeled a “consumer commando”.  No experienced salesperson wants to talk to you.  You are a time waster.  You, the consumer, want the Nordstrom treatment at Sam’s Club prices.  Not going to happen, bubba.  You will eventually buy a car but you won’t be happy.  Please understand the manufacturer has a nasty little club over dealerships called Customer Satisfaction Index.  CSI controls lots of different monies dealers and their employees earn.  A few days after your purchase, you are contacted by an opinion taker and asked to rate your experience. You are bummed out by the whole process and unload!  You have just cost the salesperson and their manager more money than they made selling you a car.  Experienced salespeople and managers will lose a sale if they think you will give them bad CSI.  Sunshine, your one deal just isn’t that critical; you are not that important.  Get your facts and your financing in order before every going to the dealership.  Make an appointment.  Try to make it with the TOP salesperson.  Call, and ask, “Who was your salesperson of the month last month”?  Make a morning appointment.  Shop in the first week of the month.  Why?  The top salesperson needs deals and knows how to make them.  A manager will take a short deal in the morning to “get the store open”.  Dealerships sell more cars at the end of the month.  Top professionals know if they are going to have a great month they need to capture the first week sales.  Third and fourth weeks will take care of themselves.

Financing is a huge profit area for a dealer.  Arrange your own before you every start shopping!!! Use a credit union.  Knowing what you can spend helps answer the “what to buy “questions.  If the dealership can beat the credit union deal,  that gives you  a nice option.  Having your financing arranged or cash in hand gives you a real edge in private party sales.  Be very careful in divulging credit information at a dealership (or anywhere).  Your should only do so AFTER you make the deal.  The dealership must report all transactions over $9,999.00 and needs your social security number to do so.  Any dealership that makes you “prove” you can buy a vehicle before negotiating with you is run by lazy, arrogant managers.  Leave!  See Rule Number One.

Trading a car?  You are now a car dealer.  The Used Car Manager is judging everything as “front line ready”.  A FLR vehicle has intact glass.  The windshield is perfect.  Everything works (wipers, power windows, air conditioning blows cold, no lights out, no hole in the dash where the radio goes) and the tires are new or look new.  The vehicle is new car showroom clean.  If your trade isn’t FLR, the manager deducts from the trade value the cost to make it FLR.  If the manager doesn’t want your trade for inventory, then what will it bring from a wholesale buyer or an auction?  He/she has a good idea, based on experience, and that is what they will write down as ACV (actual cash value). ACV, trade allowance to you, and “Book Value” are not the same.  Understand “Book Value” is what a lender will use in evaluating a loan or what an insurance company will use to settle a claim. If your trade is older than five model years it has no collateral value to a lender and the dealership probably won’t keep it. The value of any vehicle is what someone will pay for it.  If you believe you can negotiate up from invoice and down from “Blue Book” you are living in the wrong universe.  What other options are available?  Sell it yourself?  Donate it to a charity?  Say your trade has a “Book Value” of $10,000 and you are in a 30% tax bracket.  Because of the condition of your car no one will give you more than $5500.  This might be a way for you to go.

Selling your trade yourself has serious safety issues.  Do you want strangers coming to your house?  Do you think you can park vehicle in a high traffic area with a “For Sale” sign?  Probably not.  Most municipalities have ordinances prohibiting “curbing” cars.  Rarely will the “buyer” have cash in fist. They want financing schemes.  License plates stay with you unless you are in one of the few states that have a different practice. The buyer wants you to leave the plates on so they can get it home. NO! To make the deal you may need to deliver the vehicle.  As long as your plates are on the vehicle, YOU have all the liability. Use your digital camera to photograph the COMPLETE title transfer.  If the buyers name isn’t filled out and the sale price entered, you have opened yourself to a can of legal whoop ass.

The various agencies that will buy the car for you can save time and money on a new vehicle.  Many are snakes.  The only one I will recommend is AAA.

NO USED CAR IS PERFECT!  If it was it wouldn’t be for sale.  The seller knows, or expects, expensive troubles are coming and they don’t want to deal with it. Your job is to find out what (the mechanic’s inspection) and to negotiate.  I usually walk away from any vehicle with a long list of repairs.  I want the vehicle that the owner says, “I’ve kept up the maintenance and driven it.  Never had to make a repair.”

VERY IMPORTANT.  If you meeting someone to look at their vehicle, don’t take cash with you!  You don’t know for certain if you will see a vehicle or a firearm in your face.  After you have made your deal, go to your branch bank/credit union and get the cash.  Seller doesn’t like it?  Go back to Number One Rule.

UPSIDE DOWN, BAD CREDIT?  You have been making bad financial decision all your life.  Deal with it.  There is no car god that will save your sorry ass.  Life circumstances can put you in a hole (Illness, divorce, uninsured motorist accidents) but  in most cases it is YOU.  Please, be an adult and own your own shit.  Then a dealer can find a way.  Not your way; a way.

 All salespeople believe any customer can be “bumped” $50 a month on a payment.  They believe the two most important numbers to you are the down payment and the monthly payment.  That is how you  became “upside down.”

Drive by your local bank and credit unions. Often, they will have voluntary repossessions sitting in their parking lot. Won’t hurt to go inside and ask.  The lender is trying to get close to the balance due instead of sending it to auction and taking a bigger loss. Same rules apply as in buying a used car.

The military says, “Train hard - fight easy.”  You should say, “Do the hard work before the purchase and drive off with a woody!”

If none of the appeals to you, the work and effort is too much, then go to whatever dealership you want, roll over, sign everything, and get on with your life.  You will have great “whine” material to bore everyone around you.  “It isn’t my fault!  They LIED to me”.   You are a gutless wonder, and you deserve what you get.  Of course, your mileage may vary.

Evil Car Salesmen Test Drives

By way of Peter at Bayou Renaissance Man, a test drive from hell.

http://bayourenaissanceman.blogspot.com/2013/03/pity-poor-car-salesman.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+BayouRenaissanceMan+%28Bayou+Renaissance+Man%29

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q5mHPo2yDG8

Jeff Gordon in disguise. Understand it has thousands of views.

Not as bad as this one.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QC-R3YUy9Wg

My favorite movie.

Since a good portion of my adult life was spent retailing cars and trucks, I’ve had a few memorable test drives. My response to stupid driving was usually to turn off the ignition. Scary when you are in traffic, but better than the idiot running into something.  After coming to a stop, we would have a short conversation followed by a return to the lot.

One night a young (17?) man and his mother came in. He was hot for a Mustang GT, 5.0, 5 speed. OK, off we go with me driving. We changed seats in a large, empty parking lot. His first effort to launch resulted in a 270 degree spin. Scared him, and his mother. I drove us back to the lot where they purchased a 4cyl Mustang with an automatic.

The one I won’t forget was a literal life or death. Young  gangbanger type pulled a gun on me.

Back story. Pre cell phone days. The dealership had a set test drive circuit. The salesperson drove off the lot. Drivers changed at an isolated cul- de -sac. No deviations allowed.

At the changeover, he pointed a PPK clone at me. Looking into his eyes, I saw someone with no soul. I also saw he still had the safety on. Thank you Army training. Grabbed the slide, racked it back, twisted the pistol breaking his finger, and gained possession of the pistol. Hit him with it as hard as I could. He went down. I jumped into the car and drove to the nearest pay phone. When the police arrived at the cul –de- sac, he was still there, and was arrested. Fortunately, he was eighteen so no juvenile justice blow back.

Later, back at the dealership, the owner, the asshat who designed the test drive route, and I,  had a heated conversation. Our sales staff was about 50% female. They hated the changeover point; didn’t feel safe. You couldn’t fault them. Net result was the test drive route was changed. Never learned why, but shortly after that the asshat got fired. Sincerely hope I contributed to that decision.

There was the lady, fresh from Japan, who decided to drive on the side of the street most familiar to her.

When we were selling Suzuki Somersaults, er, Samurai, we had an off road course we could use. Lots of fun for the test drivers. Lots of bouncing around. One young braless lady bounced around so much, her bouncers fell out of her top. That was fun (grin). Even more fun when she “let it all hang out” laughing the whole time.

We had a female salesperson that raised some eyebrows. When she had a male customer, I knew how close she was to a deal by the number of buttons undone on her top. At the third or fourth “pencil” her third or fourth button would be undone. She would lean forward and say, “You can afford that payment, can’t you”? Done deal. Some of her test drives were unusually long. My policy? Don’t ask, don’t tell. With our other saleswomen going on a test drive with male only customers,  I made it a policy that one of us would come over and say, “Please don’t be gone too long. We have someone on the way to look at this car”. While doing this, we would make eye contact with the customer. No one left our lot until we made a copy of their driver’s license.

One thing all long term salespeople do agree; there are a lot of very bad drivers.

Welfare Queen Car Financing

Lots of chatter on blogs recently about welfare queens getting financed for a car. More news stories and blogs about sub prime car loans.

Much misinformation is being spread. My credentials?  Spent close to three decades in retail auto sales, and involved in thousands of car deals. Have been out now for five years. Things may have changed, but I doubt it. Very little fundamental change occurred in the time I worked in the business.

Excluding cash deals, a car dealer has one, and only one, customer. That is the lender. Loan structure is everything. The back and forth most car buyers hate is a process to get an agreement on a structure the lender will accept.  Leasing is just another way to finance  a purchase. As a sales manager, I wasn’t much interested in what you wanted. I was very interested in what you would do. Most vehicles are sold on one question, “If I could, would you”?

Car dealers make money on the front end of the deal, and on the back end of the deal.  All deals start with the invoice (new) or “book” on used. The front end is what percentage  the lender will finance of the invoice (dealers cost, not MSRP) or “book” (price guide lines, i.e., NADA, Kelley). This is the price the lender “owns” the vehicle and will pay the dealer without recourse. Once the consumer makes one to three payments, the dealer escapes any penalty if the consumer defaults. Back end is finance profit, insurance, warranties, etc. If the consumer defaults, a percentage of this is charged back to the dealer.

The lender looks at  the consumer using the four “C’s”, credit history, capacity, character and cash down payment.  Character can be, how long on the job, how long in the area, how many valid personal references, and the like. Capacity is how much the creditor makes,  less current obligations. Sometimes alimony and child  support  is considered. The lender wants to be able to attach wages in case of a default. Social security, military pensions, and public assistance cannot be attached.  Cash down, or trade equity, make structuring the deal much easier.

I have seen pensioners with stellar credit approved for loans. I’ve never seen someone on welfare get approved. Not saving it doesn’t happen; just, I’ve never seen it. Most likely,  a straw purchase of some kind.

Subprime is a world all alone. My personal view is those getting subprime loans have earned the right to pay high interest. A few have been caught up in things like major medical problems. Most have been making bad financial decisions their whole lives. For the lender, it is a high risk business with fairly low return (real, not on paper or “projected”).

The most difficult part of being a car dealer is buying inventory, not selling. The public really has only two questions;  how much down, and how much a month. If I could make those numbers work, they would buy a three wheeled go cart with a lawnmower engine. Acquiring inventory that allows structuring profitable deals is real work.

If readers believe they personally have “beaten the dealer”, well, more power to you. Kind of like beating a casino; the odds are on the house side.

One last word. To get the best deal, join a credit union. Get preapproved. Do some research. Then go shopping.

Sayonara Suzuki

Farewell Suzuki. My first serious entry in car peddling was Suzuki Somersaults‘, aka Samurai.

http://www.detroitnews.com/article/20121106/AUTO0104/211060329/1148/rss25

May 1986, construction was on it’s ass in the Pacific Northwest. I had a wife and three kids and was drawing unemployment. A requirement was to document three job interviews a week. One interview was with “Dangerous Dan” who showed me a picture of a “Japanese Jeep” his employer was going to be selling in a week. I figured, “What the hell, it will get me out of the house”,  commission only or not,  so agreed to work there.  Planned to try it until construction got going again. Came 2004 and I was still in the car business.

I’ve always tried to break situations and business down to basic numbers. At that time to keep a roof over our head, food on the table, electricity, and heat  I needed to bring in $144 a week.  I started making  $144 a day, some days, and in the following 14 months sold 368 Samurais, one at a time, at retail.

What the customer was buying was a 30 mpg new vehicle with a  three year warranty and a $100 per month payment. They didn’t love the car. Their alternatives, at the time, was Yugo and Hyundai.  The bright boys at Suzuki though they had a winner and started jacking up the price until the monthly payment was within $10 a month of real cars. I got the hell out and started selling Fords.

What killed Suzuki, and Isuzu before them, was selling shitty re badged GM products GM was having problems selling. Their only edge was a better warranty.  Over the years I’ve met many car company “suits”, both American and foreign. The only one, at the top levels, who knew his ass from his elbow,  was Peter Butterfield. At the zone sales manager level, only two I would have hired as salesmen.

My credentials?  How about a 20 year stack of W-2s.

More Evil Car Salesmen Stories (Vulgar and Profane)

My friend, Dirty Al, is the best car salesman I’ve ever met. He got his start with Ralph Williams. Some insight.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DK6BksCzTKs

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cVmNzoy6HKI

Neither of us ever worked for this guy.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=voW0L4EN8OY&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QOsLdT4slsk&feature=related

Reminiscing with Dirty Al, the subject turned to Arthur Floyd Kinsman, “The working man’s friend. Bring your trade and your wife and we’ll dicker.”

He was among  the most outrageous individuals I knew in the car business. Art was a decorated  Korea War Marine,  former Green Bay Packer guard, and had one of the foulest mouths I’ve  ever heard.

Some of the stories are beyond belief. Once he said to Sam M., while working a deal,  “I want you to tell your customer I want a sample of what he is smoking”. A few minutes later Sam dropped a baggie on Art’s desk. “Get that shit out of here”, Art roared.

Once  he was filling in for my manager. It was early morning and the store was empty except for a customer I had in the upstairs office and the customer's friend sitting in a corner of the showroom. The customer had rejected our first two offers. In a loud voice that echoed in the store, Art instructed me, “You go tell that banko faggot that we are the only fucking place that can get him financed and that is the fucking deal.”   After sitting down across from the customer, I said, “Ah, Milo.”  “I heard”, snarled Milo. “Where do I sign”?

Another time, unknown to the salesman and Art, a customer followed the salesman and stood just outside the entrance to the sales tower.

“Art”, said the salesman, “She wants the keys to her trade. She wants to leave”.  “Yeah”, said Art. “What does the little cunt really want”? Stepping into the tower, the customer said, “This cunt wants her keys.”  “I know that”, snarled Art. “What is it going to take to earn your business”?

At a slow off site sale, Al was on the P.A. system trying to stir excitement. He would announce a non existent sale as, “Congratulations to Mr. and Mrs. Johnson. They just bought a new Toyota”! All of us were to applaud. Then he announced, “Congratulations to Mr. and Mrs. Heater. They just bought a new Peugeot”!  (Heater, in car lingo, is a unhappy and irate customer)

Art taught me bore and stroke; down payment and monthly payment. Get the customer focused on that portion of the deal and you will make the deal.  He wouldn’t lose a deal over profit. He would say, “I’ll take a $300 deal, It is all iron, and I can get more iron. But, before I take a $300 deal, I’ll grind their tits off for four hours.”

Art’s time was before Customer Satisfaction scores became a big deal. He liked me; liked I averaged one chest bumping or fist fight a month with other salesmen. Art, the Pritchmeyer, and I, probably paid more in store fines (involuntary charity contributions) than anyone else in the organization (and I was in a distant third place).

Art lived large and died young. He strongly influenced scores of salespeople in the Seattle area. The man was without pretense; you knew exactly where you stood with him.  His highest praise? “You kinky mother fucker,” when you explained how you closed a sale.

Hope this post got a laugh or two. Serious times in our country but we still need to laugh.

Yet Again, A Car Lot Story

So, another car lot story.

Worked at a lot owned by a man with three brothers and five sisters. This family was the gene pool mother lode. All the men, including his father, were handsome by anyone’s standard. The plainest sister was drop dead gorgeous.  Plus, they were all happy people who loved to laugh and could party all night.  Fun place to work.

One of the salesmen, Gary,  had married into the family. Someone in the extended family was getting married and all the females were doing a bacherlorlette party/bar crawl/raise hell affair.

We were standing outside when two limos with huge sunroofs slowly cruised by. Several females were standing up and leaning out the sunroofs.  As they rolled by, they were yelling, “Show us your cocks”.

“Hey”, said Gary, “That’s my wife in that car”! He spun around to look at us, shocked, then was really upset by the sight of three of us unzipping our pants.

Inquiring minds wonder what transpired when he got home that night. Never heard.  

Diesel Madness = Siberian Car Sales

Yet another car lot story.

Dzevat was a very successful Siberian fisherman. DON’T call him a Russian! He owned, or was the captain of, a 525’ fish processing vessel. The details were somewhat murky and he didn’t want to discuss it. What he did have was fistfuls of US green money. His interest was any small diesel powered truck or car and larger European sedans. He had wandered into our lot and we developed a business relationship. Big man! Not often do I deal with men much larger than myself.

These diesel powered vehicles were more common in the Pacific Northwest than elsewhere. A  weekly ad in the statewide shopper (pre internet days) offering quick cash, if the price was right, allowed me to buy three or four a month to put in storage.

Two to three times a year, Dzevat would put into port in Puget Sound. He would buy one top of the line SUV, usually an Isuzu Trooper, and all the used diesels. Tough bargainer on the new vehicle but not on the used. If he knew I paid an average of $300 per and sold to him at an average of $1,200 per, he might have bargained harder. What the hell was I going to do with them if he didn’t buy?

The local shagger company would deliver them pier side and his crew would crane load them on the deck. Off they would sail to Vladivostok.

One day I got a call from him, who knows where he was calling from, telling me he was out of the car business. Nice of him to call as I had only bought two used diesels. One was a Peugeot that was featured in a previous blog.

One wonders how many of those old diesels are still operating In Siberia?

We never discussed politics, USSR - USA relations, or did any socializing. I wondered at the time if he got caught up in some political situation in Siberia. I never learned more but appreciated the opportunity to expand my horizons (and make a buck).

Commercial fishermen (and women). The only group I know that are more bat shit crazy than car salesmen.

Sorry for the jumble. Blogger and I don't get along. My bad, hate to read instructions.

Tune Ups!

As requested, another car lot story.

Diesel powered cars and light pickups were offered by car manufacturers during model years 1984-86 plus or minus a year or so. Ford put them in Escorts, Rangers, Tempos, and Lincoln Marks. These were mainly sold in the Northwest Region. Soon, they were in the used car inventory.

We had a diesel powered Escort. I had a young airman come on the lot looking for cheap, and good economy. He could drive a stick.  Off on a test drive in the Escort, he decided he liked it. Cash changed hands and he was preparing to leave with his “new” car.

“Yeah”, he said. “I’ll stop at NAPA and get a tune up kit so it will idle smoother.”

WTF? On the front fenders was a chrome decal saying “diesel”. On the instrument cluster was printed, “diesel fuel only”.  During the test drive, I had explained the function of the “Wait to Start” light, i.e, glow plugs. Under the fuel cap were the words “Diesel Fuel Only”.

“Partner,”  I thought to myself. “If you are so damn dumb you don’t know you bought a diesel, you deserve what you get.”

I just smiled, thanked him for his business, and watched him drive off, knowing that later he would blame the evil car salesman who took advantage of him.